June 22 1941 Hitler moves East.80 years ago today. Could Hitler have won ?

We wish.

NOPE ...

Once Hitler decided to invade Russia his ass was toast.

Germany/Austria had less than 1/2 the number of people as the USSR ... AND the Russians had TWO powerful weapons in their arsenal that Hitler and his Generals didn't factor in ... the Russian WINTER and Russia's HUGE size from west to east

As shown by Napoleon during his invasion merely taking the Russian cities in the west would NOT cause Russia to surrender (Napoleon took Moscow ... but that didn't help him in the least). He would have had to drive his armies ALL the way across Russia to Vladivostok, a trip of 6,261 miles (or 10,076 km) in order to fully take Russia and drive it out of the war.

The movement of his armies across Russia would have taken at least 2 years, probably 4 to 5, during which time the German Army would have had to "fight" the Russian Winter at least 3 times!!, probably 5 times!! ... and they weren't even prepared to fight it for ONE winter let alone at least THREE.

Nope ... when Hitler decided to invade Russia he LOST the War. It was only a matter of WHEN the War would be over, NOT IF he would lose it.

Look up. His order # 33.


That order cost him Russia.

33
33
33

not the tank itself, but the vast quantities the russians had of them

barbarossa was pre-emptive strike. had germany not acted when they did, the russians would have steam rolled them by 1943 and taken all of europe

Germany as a seafaring country was never on par with the Allies. They had a headstart in the Atlantic with their u-boats, but that was not sustainable once we got our shipyards cranked up. There is no way they could have won the war. Invade America? America is currently under invasion. Once again, cranking up will happen soon, and the threat will soon disappear. Stupid fux are always underestimating the will of the American Patriot

Rubbish, the T-34 is a beast, so much so they can run on their wheels is they throw tracks, auto-loading gun, gyroscopic targeting etc, etc.

Sure, assuming the British and French hadn't let their insecurities get the best of them, and didn't initiate WWII by declaring war on Germany...
If German had the freedom to focus solely on the defeating the Soviets, they would have. And they definitely would have if the British and French had joined forces with them, instead of continuing to squash German power... all because the German's potential power threatened theirs into looking pathetic by comparison.
It was the same thing with Union vs the Confederates. The Union feared the rapidly growing economic power of the Confederates, and knew that they must be crushed before they became too big of a giant to fight against.

The British and French join forces with Germany against the Soviet Union? How do you see that happening since Hitler already had a deal with Stalin? France and Britain couldn't because it was Adolf Hitler who on the eve of WWII made a deal with Stalin, the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact dividing up Eastern Europe including Poland which they invaded together. The two armies met at the bug river and celebrated as friends.



And the Soviets were still supplying Germany with oil and grains as they overran France. Then the Luftwaffe bombed the shit out of the UK for a solid year. You think at this point the Brits or French should have said we forgive you now let's attack your friends the Soviets?

The Soviets wanted to grow strong and spread communism, however the needed large numbers of weapons, and the purges of the 1930s had stripped the Red Army of many experienced commanders. As part of the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact Germany had given the Soviets permission to take Finland. The Red Army did very poorly in the Winter War of 1939-1940 and were hurt badly by the outnumbered Fins who finally ran out of ammo and equipment and were forced to make a deal. 6 months later the Wehrmacht stormed through Western Europe easily beating the powerful French army and BEF. The Red Army posed no threat to the Germans, but this was the end game Hitler had been looking for. Hitler wanted Lebensraum or living space for the German people. His goal was Poland along with the fertile grain fields of Ukraine and the Caucus's for the oil.

The Nazis and Communists were allies the first 2 years of the war and by the time Hitler turned on the Soviet Union he was already at war with most of he rest of the world. The US wasn't in the war yet but days after Peral Harbor Hitler declared was on the US. Smart thing to do after a crushing defeat at the gates of Moscow, right?

The bad guys won judging by how bad things are now.

That was in a discussion with Mannerheim for Mannerheim birthday in a train car. Hitler talking about the huge numbers of Soviet tanks as am excuse as to why the German invasion had stalled. Mannerheim had to have been amused as his Finnish troops destroyed the Red Army that invaded Finland.

Hitler was hoping to get help from Finland in the siege of Leningrad. The Fins had been an ally and pushed the Soviets back to the pre-Winter War boundary and stopped. By this action it is obvious they new Hitler had sold their ass to the Soviets. The Germans needed their help and they wouldn't. The Siege of Leningrad lasted from September 1941 until January 1944 and cost over a million civilian lives. Finally the Red Army came and chased away Army Group North.

So this is an interesting meeting on several levels including the only known recording of him in his natural voice.

watch on youtube

True about T-34 sheer quantity defeating the Germans, but those quantities were built mostly in 1942, and later.

If Germans had done what they should've done (from a strategic point of view) from the very beginning, instead of wasting their time, manpower, and resources on Moscow and Stalingrad, they could definitely have won (effectively won, leaving a simple cleanup operation for 1942) the war in the East by the end of 1941.

What they should've done is completely cut Russian access to oil fields, as without oil (energy and fuel), both Russian manufacturing and any and all already built tanks would've been completely useless.

Fortunately for all of us, Nazis were just as big imbeciles as the ones who are today "commanding" U.S., Russian, and Chinese military forces.

I say fortunately, because if those imbeciles were even slightly more competent, their psycho (bio-drone) bosses would've already exterminated the whole human race without as much as a hiccup in "their" (their AI master's) plan.

Sheer incompetence on the part of the whole officer cadre is what has kept us alive so far... but is also the very thing that will be the end of us all in the very near future.

My point is -- Nazi-level of imbecile incompetence has run its course as a useful (stalling) tactics, and should be (in fact, should have been, years ago) replaced with the proper kind of absolute competence, but since that change ain't gonna happen... I guess I'm just blowing my ass with this whole post.

You can safely disregard everything you've just read.