The Prideful Free-Will Doctrine Causes People To Become Modern Day Pharisees

Ans then there is this.

Belief in a cruel sadiatic God...creates cruel sadistic followers.



Thread: Jesus LOVES the little children of the WORLD>..even though.....

He will lose not one.

For God to see what you really are Free-will is required.

Consider how boring things would be without beings having free-will?

They could never become more, make accidental discoveries and you would be able to predict them 100%.

You must have a very boring God who is afraid of stuff to not want free-willed beings except themselves.

Doesn't really stand up to the test of logic a Superior being would have does it.

Free-will makes things interesting for God.

Those who would reject it are rejecting his gift of life and all the possibilities that go with it.

So seven billion people who had ZERO CHOICE in where they were born..what religion they were raised in..or control fro the most part in their lives..all end up in misery FOREVER through NO FAULT of their own..for a choice they COULD NOT MAKE because they never HAD a choice..because the choice of where they were born..WHO they were born to..and what religion they were born INTO..was GODS choice all along?

And YOU say that God will abandon MOST of humanity for a choice HE DAMN WELL MADE FOR them?

Enjoy your mental sickness.

OP, it is Jesus who opens the seven seals of judgment during the Tribulation and Jesus won’t judge Himself along with His body of Holy Spirit-filled believers because He’s already taken judgment and the wrath of God on the cross for those who believe.

Believers are one body in Christ with Jesus at the head, He will not incur judgement yet again as this would negate His sacrifice on the cross for mankind. Why is this so hard for you to understand?

It’s beyond sad how low you view Jesus’ sacrifice on the cross for His own, He will not send His own into divine judgment nor has God ever done this in the history of humanity.

The righteous are not divinely judged and believers are made righteous through faith (Romans 3:22) therefore they are removed before the Tribulation begins (2 Thessalonians 2:7-8), see Lot and Noah for any proof that God doesn’t judge the righteous.

it seems some here dont quite understand the concept of free will.

Notice the errie silence of this thread???

Its hard to say "GOD IS LOVE" when you look into the faces of all those sweet innocent children..KNOWING that God will be spending eternity making sure they SCREAM and SCREAM and SCREAM....OH the wonderful love of GOD!

Women should be ASHAMED of having Kids..knowing that it only gives God more people to BUUUUUUUUUUUUUURN!

IF God is infinite and omnipresent..then by that FACT alone..there CANNOT be a place where god CANNOT BE.

Your own doctrine CONTRADICTS your own doctrine.

Typical christian though..SO mentally fucked in the head they cant even see their own stupidity and obvious inconsistencies.

Free will means you're omnipotent god.

Any limitation to free will eliminates it.

We have limited will at best.

One other thing..every soul and spirit exists because GOD creted it and sustains it.

That means that where there is LIFE there is GOD..and if there is LIFE in hell..then GOD would have to be there sustaining it and propogating it..therefore he is also present in hell..and if he os present in hell which he would HAVE to be for life to BE there..then he is directly responsible for the torture and misery of BILLIONS.

Do you masturbate to this god of misery much?

It seems most chritians get almost ORGASMIC when they describe hell and its various "Pleasures"..

You are indeed a sick bunch of depraved idiots who cant even figure out the BLATANT contradictions in your INSANE doctrines.

The Heaven and Earth and All that are in them. God owns and not us.

He saves us. He makes peace with us. Friends and brethren.

War is this fight. Peace is coming.

Jude 22 And of some have compassion, making a difference
23 And others save with fear

You don't seem to understand.

It's Jesus that is keeping you from God.

He's the one in your way.

Do you think railing against God and bearing false witness of Him as far as sending children to hell benefits you in any way? No, it only deepens the hole you’re in presently. The only reason you’re breathing right now is by His grace alone.

It’s time to grow up and take some responsibility for yourself and your loved ones. It’s well past time to stop being lazy, selfish, and ignorant and realize you’re in a war for your soul. Every single person alive is fighting for their soul.

It’s time to not only help yourself by seeking God for the first time in your life but in gaining freedom, help others to do the same. This is why we’re all here and the only reason you feel the way you do is because you lack knowledge and are ignorant to the word of God. You’ve never actually sought God, you instead choose to sit back and do as your father does best, falsely accuse.

Draw close to God and He’ll draw close to you and He will reveal knowledge to you and give you wisdom and understanding. He’ll soften that heart of stone you have and give you perspective, peace, and save your soul.

Last Edited by Seek^ on 11/20/2023 07:22 PM

Job 38:9 When I made the cloud, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it,
10 And brake up for it my decreed place
11 And said, Hitherto shalt thou come, but no further

How come anytime someone vents their despite at the doctrine of eternal torture you right away say they hate GOD?

Whats NOT to hate about a God that will happily burn alive almost every child ever born simply because HE chose to have them born into the wrong fait..religion..or culkture where they HAD NO CHOICE!

If you believe God..THIS god that does this is GOOD>.you are ONE TWISTED FREAK.

OP said NOTHING about hating God..only mention the WRONG Gos..you know..the evil bastard with the torture and fire fetish who loves ALL children..for a moment..and then plans to BURN THEM ALL ALIVE FOREVER!...just because they are not a HATE FILLED TWISTED FREAK WITH A MENTAL PROBLEM like YOU obviously are...believing in a twisted evil god like that.

Jesus came to set us FREE...not BURN US ALL ALIVE FOREEVER simply because we happenned to be born in a bad neighborhood.

You and your twisted evil prick of a god can go jump.

Seek, you contradict yourself in your beliefs. Are the saints who come out of great tribulation in Revelation 7:14 NOT part of the body of Christ?

Are you suggesting that it's okay for them to go through tribulation because they need a second chance to make the right choice?

No, God's saints are absolutely NOT appointed to wrath (i.e. eternal damnation), but to receive eternal life (i.e. salvation).

Because you equate tribulation with judgment and wrath, you fail to grasp the error in your doctrine.

Saints who are/were martyred are/were NOT receiving God's judgment. Martyrdom has been a part of Christianity since the very beginning, starting with Stephen and lasting through the inquisitions and crusades of the dark ages, and even beyond.

Millions of saints, over the past 2000 years, have been martyred for their faith and testimony in Christ.

It's very much a significant part of Church history. What do you say about all those millions who have suffered persecution and martyrdom for their faith in Christ?

Anything? Do you simply not know about them, or have you forgotten them?

Martyrdom is not judgment. It is tribulation, and it's promised by Christ Himself and the scriptures that we would all suffer SOME kind of tribulation or persecution during our Christian walk.

"Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also." John 15:20

"These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world." John 16:33

"Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God." Acts 14:22

Paul said that right after being stoned and left for dead.

I highly suggest that you go and read Foxe's Book Of Martyrs and refresh your memory of those beloved saints who drank the same cup and who were baptized with the same baptism that our Lord drank and was baptized with.

Lot, Noah, and their families were not raptured off the face of the earth. They were protected through God's judgment.

And something that you may want to consider is that sometimes God allows His people to die, physically, in order to save them from some evil to come.

"The righteous perisheth, and no man layeth it to heart: and merciful men are taken away, none considering that the righteous is taken away from the evil to come." Isaiah 57:1

If you're a Christian, you should not fear physical death. And those who believe in a pre-trib doctrine possess too much fear of physical death.

Curious, how do you know how, by what way, or the number of times God talks to a person’s heart in their life in hopes they’ll turn to Him before they die regardless of where or how they were raised?

You don’t know, you ignorantly assume.

How do you know God sends all kids to hell who do not grow up in the Christian faith?

You don’t and He doesn’t, you ignorantly assume and bear false witness against God Almighty.


Do you not know that God knows when you will die and when everyone will die? Do you know God wishes that no one should perish and this includes you in your disgusting mockery of Him? Do you know He wants you a part of His family but He can’t force His love on you?


Why is it so hard to understand that a perfectly holy God who has established a law must uphold the law otherwise He wouldn’t be God? Why is it so hard to just believe in Jesus who died for you to cover the filth of your sins and in believing, He supernaturally changes you making it possible for you to enter Heaven upon physical death and not go to hell?

Why do you deny God’s free sacrifice for you? I don’t get it and never will. Why don’t you want to be close to your own Creator? Why don’t you understand that your ignorance of the truth is why you’re in darkness and God is perfect, you cannot find fault in Him.

The thief on the cross believed in His heart Jesus was who He said He was and simply asked Jesus for acceptance, that’s all God asks from any of us. It’s not hard, just believe and realize your questions will be answered and what you accuse God of is completely misguided grounded in no truth whatsoever. Stop serving Satan, God’s waiting for you.

Fuuuck...what??

I glanced over some of your posts, and what I see is someone who is very angry and who sets himself/herself above God.

I won't tell you that God loves you because that's not what the Bible tells Christians to preach. We preach the gospel of Jesus Christ, that is, salvation through belief in the work He accomplished on His cross;

That He came to the earth as God in the flesh, lived a perfectly sinless life and was crucified, died, was buried, and resurrected from the dead on the third day for the remission of sins.

Here's the thing. God is not willing that any of His little ones should perish, and therefore, we preach to the whole world in order that all the little ones who belong to God will hear His Word and come to the fold.

All others are what the Bible calls vessels of wrath, fitted to destruction, and they serve a purpose; God's purpose.

He put them on the earth as brute beasts made to be taken and destroyed so, "that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory." Romans 9:23

In other words, there has to be a Heaven and a Hell. If there is no Hell, then how would those in Heaven know what they have been saved from?

God made you exactly how He wanted to make you. And if He made you as a vessel of wrath, fitted to destruction, then you will never choose to love and obey Him. You will continue casting aspersion and curses on Him, as He designed you to do. And you will very much deserve your judgment...if you are a vessel of wrath.

If, however, you are a vessel of mercy prepared unto glory, then you WILL come to repentance and belief in Jesus Christ, and you WILL be conformed to His image when God is ready for you to.

That's who God is. He's a Powerful, Almighty God who is in perfect control over all His creation, from beginning to end, and He will do all His pleasure.

So if one day you fall to your knees in repentance and cry out to the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, then leap for joy that He had mercy on you from the foundation of the world.

That's more truth than I would normally give a stranger at first, but you come across as one who like to cut through the fluff. It's the hard truth, plain and simple. I truly hope you wind up loving it like I do.

And no, I don't have a blood lust for vessels of wrath, nor would I want to see them die and go to hell. As a matter of fact, if I found myself at the gates of Hell and able to hear people in pain, my human nature would kick in and I would probably want to let them out.

Well, God would not. He put them there for His purpose, and I don't dare question my God who says to His creation,

"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8-9

Loving christians in action.



Thread: Christian LOVE at its finets..brought to you by the HELL screamers.

It's not what I'm suggesting, it's what God's word plainly warns. God wants all to repent and to become the bride of Christ. People who enter into the 7-year Tribulation have not repented and ignored the Holy Spirit throughout their lives otherwise they'd have been taken. You act as though the people in the flood got a second chance. They were warned for years by Noah and they mocked and denied His testimony. You along with others fulfill prophecy today by doing the same.

Behold, I will throw her onto a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her I will throw into great tribulation, unless they repent of her works
Revelation 2:22





Tribulation Saints are different from the Bride of Christ in that the bride is taken during the age of grace. Tribulation Saints die physical deaths including the sealed 144k WHO GOD ALLOWS SATAN TO KILL. Although they die physical deaths, they escape eternal damnation.

Then the beast was permitted to wage war against the saints and to conquer them, and it was given authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation.
Revelation 3:17





Just as in the days of Noah (as Jesus specifically compares the Tribulation to the flood because it will bring death to the vast majority of the world and both are divine judgment from God) and just as in the days of Lot (as Jesus specifically compares the Tribulation to the destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah because both are divine judgment from God), the Tribulation itself is divine judgment and this fact is what separates this period like the Flood and the destruction at Sodom from every other martyr's death or persecution suffered for God in human history. There's a difference between the wrath of God and the wrath of man.

God will not judge the righteous and believers are made righteous through faith (Romans 3:22).

Who enters the Tribulation? Regardless of their confession of the mouth, unbelievers are left behind and only God knows the heart. Unbelievers who live under incremental wrath of God because they choose not to believe. The Tribulation will see the fullness of His wrath for unbelievers.

Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
John 3:36





There's a difference between the seven seals of judgment and Great Tribulation versus everyday tribulation which Biblically is defined as troubles and persecution believers may face in their lives even unto death at the hands of men. You have to understand context of the verses you quote above.

Paul did say those words and he also wasn't experiencing divine judgment at the time. For the time period of divine judgment in the Tribulation period to fulfill Daniel's 70 week prophecy, He told us to encourage one another because we wouldn't be here for it and that we were righteous through faith. He told us we would not be here for this future time period of divine judgment and the restrainer is removed before the Antichrist is revealed.




They weren't Raptured but they were deemed righteous through faith therefore God put them in a place of safety before divine judgment took place just as believers in Christ who are one body in Christ will be taken to a place of safety because they too are righteous through faith which is a gift from God.




I don't fear death, you equate wanting to be in the presence of Jesus during the Resurrection and in Heaven for the Marriage of the Lamb with escaping the Tribulation which couldn't be any further from the truth. You believe those who actually know the scriptural truth of the pretribulation Rapture possess too much fear but what your words tell me is you not only do not know or understand scripture, you do not know what it means or feels to actually be a Christian born again otherwise you wouldn't be tearing down truth and throwing out lies about fear and escapism.

I've already explained all of this to you in the past. Your continual fight against plain scriptural truth means there's something personal going on with you and God. Repent and fully submit to God and Escape! Ask Him to reveal the truth to you.

If you were an actual Christian, you'd know a Christian doesn't fear death and you'd be excited for what's coming and encouraging others as God told us through Paul and be Watching as Jesus Himself commanded us, not fearful and tearing down the Blessed Hope and Promise of Christ and sowing confusion. Those not Watching will be assigned a place with the hypocrites who will be left behind where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, this is in reference to those who are left behind ensnared in the Tribulation of God's judgment on the world. Ask God to fill your heart and open your eyes. He will if you ask from your heart in humbleness and sincerity. We do not fear because we know we are saved and there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus.



There is no fear in love, but perfect love drives out fear, because fear involves punishment. The one who fears has not been perfected in love.
1 John 4:18

We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.
2 Corinthians 5:8


Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day on which your Lord will come. But understand this: If the homeowner had known in which watch of the night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. For this reason, you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour you do not expect.

Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of his household, to give the others their food at the proper time? Blessed is that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns. Truly I tell you, he will put him in charge of all his possessions.

But suppose that servant is wicked and says in his heart, ‘My master will be away a long time.’ And he begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards. The master of that servant will come on a day he does not expect and at an hour he does not anticipate. Then he will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Matthew 24:42-51

Last Edited by Seek^ on 11/20/2023 10:22 PM

Seek, it's obvious to me that you don't even understand your own doctrine. You throw bold assumptions and scriptures at the wall and hope that doctrinal integrity will stick together somehow.

And the more you throw, the better, because then people don't see any chance at reasoning with you due to your unbiblical, illogical speculations, which in your mind, then renders you the "victor," further feeding into your prideful and bad understanding of the scriptures.

The whole gist of this thread was to point out that the free-will doctrine is one that glorifies the prideful in heart.

The fact that you actually believe that there is a specific, future seven-year tribulation, with a future, unknown antichrist is bad enough, but then to teach that others (less virtuous than you) will get a "second chance" at salvation is extremely telling of your prideful position.

If you truly were a believer, and not a modern day pharisee, you would agree that you had absolutely ZERO to do with your salvation. Dead men don't accept anything, including any free gifts. They're dead, and that's what the Bible teaches.

"And you hath he quickened (made alive), who were dead in trespasses and sins; Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world....and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)...

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." Ephesians 2:1-10

No honest person, much less someone who calls himself a Christian, can read that text and claim he accepted Christ into his heart by his own choice or free will.

True Christians were created in Christ Jesus UNTO good works that God "hath BEFORE ORDAINED that we should walk in them."

God before ordained salvation for His family. If you came to spiritual life, it had absolutely nothing to do with your free will choice. So the second-chance nonsense is just that. Prideful nonsense.

And then you'll undoubtedly try to refute scripture with scripture by quoting a verse like Acts 2:21, which says,

"And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved," and then claim that that's proof of free will.

You can't negate scripture with scripture. They have to harmonize with each other. The fact is that goats of the world will NEVER be able to call on the name of the Lord.

If someone does not call on the name of the Lord, it means that they were not created in Christ Jesus unto good works that God did not "before ordain" that they should walk in them.

If you can see that truth, then maybe there's hope for turning you away from the evil futurist doctrine that you preach that has led the whole world astray.

You don't even believe there will be a 7-year Tribulation which puts you in the 1% fringe cult that has misinterpreted a single verse in Daniel 9:27, why are you debating a Rapture? Of course you don't believe in a Rapture, you deny God's judgment coming to this earth so how could there be a Rapture in the first place?

It's not the least bit surprising you're also an open Calvinist who denies the commission set forth by Christ to spread the Gospel. Why?

Because again, you've misinterpreted a handful of Bible verses and allowed men to shape your Biblical worldview instead of God.

You're lost friend, beyond lost. The reason? Religious doctrinal pride from the YouTube videos you watch a couple of which you linked for me a year ago that I personally watched. You still parrot the ridiculous heresies they do here and you've been doing this for years. I started a thread about your condition a couple days ago actually. Good luck to you.

Thread: Do you have love for the truth?

Last Edited by Seek^ on 11/21/2023 09:39 AM

I stand with 18 centuries worth of true Christians who knew the actual truth. You stand with the apostate church of the last 200 years.

The fact that you can admit this information without realizing your delusion speaks to the power of that delusion over the millions of people like you.

Once again, just some helpful information for when you find yourself stuck in a world of true Christian persecution and the realization that the pre-trib rapture doctrine was a contortion of the scriptures and is not happening like you expected....whatever you do, DON'T start worshipping the real man of sin on earth, the Papacy.

That's just for future reference and in the hopes that you will eventually come out of your strong delusion and belief in the lie.

Then understand that the rapture, resurrection, gathering together of the saints to meet Jesus in the air WON'T happen until the last trump of Revelation. I will continue praying for you.