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AnneFranksDrumKit

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11/14/2020 12:04 PM
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All authority is derived from the use of force and/or the threat of use of force.

At that point the only questions are whether you can meet or surpass it with your own use of force, and whether you are willing to exert your own authority.

All of a cops "authority" comes from a small caliber handgun on his hip for instance, so you can submit or carry a rifle and soft armour everywhere.

There is no legitimate authority besides your own.
 Quoting: I DO NOT CONSENT 72223709

There is soooo much truth to this it is scary.

Jesus' own words supported this concept: "But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after your body has been killed, has authority to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him."

Last Edited by AnneFranksDrumKit on 11/14/2020 12:04 PM
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 12:05 PM
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Yeah remember Samson ? Yes can pick and choose passage to fit our narrative. Samson learned his lesson but in the end he tore it all down for God.

We have been crippled but now it's time to bring them to their knees financially, the only God they know.

Spend accordingly. Stop the false idolatry.
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 12:17 PM
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Yeah remember Samson ? Yes can pick and choose passage to fit our narrative. Samson learned his lesson but in the end he tore it all down for God.

We have been crippled but now it's time to bring them to their knees financially, the only God they know.

Spend accordingly. Stop the false idolatry.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 61315891


This world is not our's we are in a deluge of debauchery. I want to bring it down too but that's our flesh speaking. These things must come and we have to be stronger. I never prayed for any election until now and I know God puts people in place. My prayer was your will not mine. We all know the outcome of a Biden presidency and we need to strengthen ourselves. This is what we prepped for.
BathMoy
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11/14/2020 12:19 PM
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I have nearly completed calculations of wealth destroyed from usury in two thousand and twenty years. It does include results for both straight loss, but also loss plus compounded interest.

I am deeply concerned at the preliminary results, however, because the debt does not appear to be repayable.
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 12:19 PM
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Paul was a false apostle. Discard anything and everything that he says.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 79234724


True.

Paul was a zealous fanatic *** who sought to destroy the budding church out of vicious hatred of Jesus. He even admitted so himself in the Bible!

When he couldn't destroy the church from the outside, he "converted" and sought to destroy it from within instead.

It's amazing how few Christians realize this. It's so damn obvious from how everything Paul says seeks to undermine what Jesus said. And yet, lots and lots of Christians will believe things that are in direct contradiction to what Jesus said, just because Paul said so.

Pop quiz, Christians: who was your messiah?

1. Jesus

2. Paul

Who should you be trusting here? Jesus, or Paul?

Think about it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75717867


Christ is Messiah.
Jesus and Paul preached Christ Principle.
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 12:21 PM
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You realize, I hope, that sedition is condemned in Gal 5:20? Christians are supposed to submit to their local authorities, at least in everything except things which would contradict how the Bible tells us to personally live or worship. As romans 13 teaches, those who otherwise resist will bring upon themselves wrath and condemnation. Keep in mind this epistle was written when Israe1 was under the opressing tyranny of rome -not a righteous or godly nation. God uses tyrants to judge a nation, just look at the Old Testament, it's full of such examples when His people go apostate.

Be careful how you teach! (James 3:1)

Your title basically says "part of the Bible is wrong and no longer relevant". That should be an obvious indicator you may be teaching heresy.

[link to contendingforthefaithblog.wordpress.com (secure)]
 Quoting: Make Constitution Great Again


Well then, guess we should never have fought the Revolutionary War against England, after all, they were an “authority”.

Make the Constitution great again? We wouldn’t have one if we followed your interpretation. I think I see who the the heretic is here.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 79234724


Just because God allows something happen for a greater purpose at a certain time in history, doesn't mean it's His ideal for His people. I've clearly made my point infallibly with scripture; which is God's Word and therefore ultimate revealed will; thus the heretic is you; go ahead; test out your little theory; and see how things work out for you. You were warned.
 Quoting: Make Constitution Great Again


Let’s go with this.

How would you ever know if God wants us to rebel again like we did in the 1700s?

Just shut up and take it until death?
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 12:32 PM
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bump
samanthasunflower

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11/14/2020 12:34 PM

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We aren't supposed to resist Godly government.

My government explicitly rejects god. I'm supposed to resist satanic governments.
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 12:38 PM
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I hesitate to post here, because it's obvious that everyone already has their mind made up...

But, just in case someone doesn't and wants a different opinion, here goes:

It's easy to "cherry pick" a verse out of the Bible and make it say what you want it to say. But, you should look at the whole context of the passage and make your decision from there.

Yes, Romans 13:1 says you should obey your rulers.

Why?!?

Verse 3 goes on to tell us: "3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong."

Basically, this verse is saying that the government is a force for good, and punishes those who do wrong.

Under this set up, OF COURSE we should obey those placed above us to rule. They keep evil at bay by punishing those who do wrong.

BUT, here's the skinny.

We now have a government who calls evil good, and good evil.

They are no longer operating the way God intended them to operate.

They are operating out of his will.

Therefore, we are NOT TO FOLLOW THEM AND OBEY THEM.

JMO/YMMV.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


I agree, understanding the proper context is always essential, and here we have a context of respecting rulers because they are a force for good.

When rulers are no longer a force for good, then this recommendation obviously collapses into its own footprint.

But I want to bring your attention to another crucial point:

What's Jesus' perspective on all this?

It is my humble opinion that Jesus is the gold standard against which all is to be weighed. Everything in the Bible must be interpreted through how it fits with what Jesus had to say about it.

And what Jesus said about rulers, is basically just "give unto Caesar...".

Jesus reminds us that the Kingdom of God is not of this world, that God is concerned with saving our souls, not our physical bodies or making our earthly existence more cnovenient. In other words, God and Jesus give very few fucks about the things we normal humans think are so important, because they see that all of that is worthless dross, and the true thing of value is spirit only.

On the topic of taxes, Jesus tells us to give Caesar what Caesar wants, because it's already his to begin with! Ceasar's face was on the coins in Jesus' time, and our modern day "Caesars" still own the currency we use, because they print it. It's theirs! If they demand iy back, give it to them!

BUT!

Jesus also reminds us that our souls are the property of God, and we should return God's property to him as well.

Jesus is ONLY concerned with our spiritual destiny - he is here to save our souls, nothing else! Everything he says about earthly things is said in the context of explaining God's kingdom, and how we can merit entrance to it.

Because NOTHING ELSE FUCKING MATTERS to God.

Anything that detracts or distracts from this simple message is in effect derailing you from the path laid out by Jesus.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75717867


You sound like a Jehovah's Witness. Won't fight, won't be a police officer, won't vote - but you sure like the protection that comes from the military and police and the freedoms (at least in the past) that were afforded us and maintained because people got off their butts and voted for freedom.
AnneFranksDrumKit

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11/14/2020 01:09 PM
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This is all very interesting. I have always felt uncomfortable about much of the writings of Paul. And from another site I have read where he never really seemed to repent for killing Christians, but boasted of it. I consider him a very boastful man.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77590476

I'm not ready to completely write off Paul, but I think about the following:

Whose writings seem boastful? Answer: Paul's

Whose writings seem bipolar, by declaring "you are saved by grace alone," and then seemingly contradicting that teaching by giving a litany of things people must/should follow? Answer:
Paul's

Whose writings created 1000's of different christian denominations? Answer: Paul's

Who's teachings seem to bring peace and unity to those who strictly follow them alone? Answer: Jesus'

I've never been at peace trying to follow Paul's writings.

I've been 100% at peace following Jesus' teachings.

Go figure...

Last Edited by AnneFranksDrumKit on 11/14/2020 01:14 PM
AnneFranksDrumKit

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11/14/2020 01:13 PM
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Let’s go with this.

How would you ever know if God wants us to rebel again like we did in the 1700s?

Just shut up and take it until death?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward


I think it's easy (in theory).

You have to quiet yourself for a while and contemplate shit.

Seriously ponder things and listen to your heart.

Your heart will give you the answer that is right and true.

Actually taking action and following the truth is a different story all together.

At least, that's been my experience...
chauchat

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11/14/2020 01:16 PM
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I hesitate to post here, because it's obvious that everyone already has their mind made up...

But, just in case someone doesn't and wants a different opinion, here goes:

It's easy to "cherry pick" a verse out of the Bible and make it say what you want it to say. But, you should look at the whole context of the passage and make your decision from there.

Yes, Romans 13:1 says you should obey your rulers.

Why?!?

Verse 3 goes on to tell us: "3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong."

Basically, this verse is saying that the government is a force for good, and punishes those who do wrong.

Under this set up, OF COURSE we should obey those placed above us to rule. They keep evil at bay by punishing those who do wrong.

BUT, here's the skinny.

We now have a government who calls evil good, and good evil.

They are no longer operating the way God intended them to operate.

They are operating out of his will.

Therefore, we are NOT TO FOLLOW THEM AND OBEY THEM.

JMO/YMMV.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


I agree, understanding the proper context is always essential, and here we have a context of respecting rulers because they are a force for good.

When rulers are no longer a force for good, then this recommendation obviously collapses into its own footprint.

But I want to bring your attention to another crucial point:

What's Jesus' perspective on all this?

It is my humble opinion that Jesus is the gold standard against which all is to be weighed. Everything in the Bible must be interpreted through how it fits with what Jesus had to say about it.

And what Jesus said about rulers, is basically just "give unto Caesar...".

Jesus reminds us that the Kingdom of God is not of this world, that God is concerned with saving our souls, not our physical bodies or making our earthly existence more cnovenient. In other words, God and Jesus give very few fucks about the things we normal humans think are so important, because they see that all of that is worthless dross, and the true thing of value is spirit only.

On the topic of taxes, Jesus tells us to give Caesar what Caesar wants, because it's already his to begin with! Ceasar's face was on the coins in Jesus' time, and our modern day "Caesars" still own the currency we use, because they print it. It's theirs! If they demand iy back, give it to them!

BUT!

Jesus also reminds us that our souls are the property of God, and we should return God's property to him as well.

Jesus is ONLY concerned with our spiritual destiny - he is here to save our souls, nothing else! Everything he says about earthly things is said in the context of explaining God's kingdom, and how we can merit entrance to it.

Because NOTHING ELSE FUCKING MATTERS to God.

Anything that detracts or distracts from this simple message is in effect derailing you from the path laid out by Jesus.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75717867

Yes, and like you say-
"explaining God's kingdom, and how we can merit entrance to it."
God's kingdom by which He will Sanctify His name , set it apart from reproach, and in which His will will be done on earth, as it is in heaven.

Matt. 22:15
Then the Pharisees went and conspired together in order to trap him in his speech. 16 So they sent their disciples to him, together with party followers of Herod, saying: “Teacher, we know you are truthful and teach the way of God in truth, and you do not seek anyone’s favor, for you do not look at the outward appearance of people.
17 Tell us, then, what do you think? Is it lawful to pay head tax to Caesar or not?”
18 But Jesus, knowing their wickedness, said: “Why do you put me to the test, hypocrites? 19 Show me the tax coin.” They brought him a denarius. 20 He said to them: “Whose image and inscription is this?” 21 They said: “Caesar’s.” Then he said to them: “Pay back, therefore, Caesar’s things to Caesar, but God’s things to God.”

Pay back: Lit., “Give back.” Caesar minted the coins, so he had a right to ask for some of them back. But Caesar did not have the right to ask a person to dedicate or devote his life to him. God gave humans “life and breath and all things.” (Ac 17:25) So a person can “give back” his life and devotion only to God, the one who has the right to require exclusive devotion.

Caesar’s things to Caesar: Jesus’ reply here, and in the parallel accounts at Mr 12:17 and Lu 20:25, is his only recorded reference to the Roman emperor. “Caesar’s things” include payment for services rendered by the secular government as well as the honor and relative subjection that is to be shown to such authorities.—Ro 13:1-7.

God’s things to God: This includes a person’s wholehearted worship, whole-souled love, and complete, loyal obedience.



Matthew 4:10

10 Then Jesus said to him: “Go away, Satan! For it is written: ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’”


Matthew 22:37, 38
37 He said to him: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind.’ 38 This is the greatest and first commandment.


Acts 5:29
29 In answer Peter and the other apostles said: “We must obey God as ruler rather than men.


Romans 14:8

8 For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah.
Anonymous Coward
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11/14/2020 01:19 PM
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"Let every person be subject to the governing authorities"

Probably to keep us from being jailed or imprisoned, beaten or killed!

If you go the other route, it might not turn out good for you. Do it at your own risk. And Good luck!
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:27 PM
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The ass licking complaint Nazarene said; "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's; and render unto God what is God's".


The Daughter of Satan has an update:

"Tell those two malignant entities to keep their grubby paws off THAT WHICH WAS NOT THEIRS TO BEGIN WITH; and keep everything you honestly earn for yourself.




[link to www.amazon.com (secure)]
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:30 PM
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Christianity...a splendid anodyne for Good Slaves!
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:30 PM
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Christianity...a splendid anodyne for Good Slaves!
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:30 PM
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Christianity...a splendid anodyne for Good Slaves!
Zoinkaeon

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11/14/2020 01:31 PM

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Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and give unto God that which is God's.
Ash Nazg Durbatulûk, Ash Nazg Gimbatul, Ash Nazg Thrakatulûk, Agh Burzum-ishi Krimpatul
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:32 PM
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Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and give unto God that which is God's.
 Quoting: Zoinkaeon


Is there an echo is this room?
AnneFranksDrumKit

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11/14/2020 01:32 PM
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The ass licking complaint Nazarene said; "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's; and render unto God what is God's".

 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489

Sounds like you've never had a legit interaction with Him.

If so, you would have written, "The ass kicking Nazarene said..."

Just an observation.

Last Edited by AnneFranksDrumKit on 11/14/2020 01:33 PM
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:34 PM
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The ass licking complaint Nazarene said; "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's; and render unto God what is God's".

 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489

Sounds like you've never had a legit interaction with Him.

If so, you would have written, "The ass kicking Nazarene said..."

Just an observation.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


Lolz...he died in ignominy on a tree outside Jerusalem...

I would rather be Satan's Whore than the Brie of Christ!
AnneFranksDrumKit

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11/14/2020 01:39 PM
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The ass licking complaint Nazarene said; "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's; and render unto God what is God's".

 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489

Sounds like you've never had a legit interaction with Him.

If so, you would have written, "The ass kicking Nazarene said..."

Just an observation.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


Lolz...he died in ignominy on a tree outside Jerusalem...

I would rather be Satan's Whore than the Brie of Christ!
 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489


Choking on Satan's cock for all eternity doesn't sound that appealing to me.

But, hey, different strokes for different strokes.

You do you, Boo.
hwy_ho

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11/14/2020 01:39 PM
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Governments adapt

The old woman who pestered the judge proves it

Pray pray and pray more and more to God until he gives you your prayer

Pester the heck out of God wiith prayer until like the judge. He relents
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:46 PM
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The ass licking complaint Nazarene said; "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's; and render unto God what is God's".

 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489

Sounds like you've never had a legit interaction with Him.

If so, you would have written, "The ass kicking Nazarene said..."

Just an observation.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


Lolz...he died in ignominy on a tree outside Jerusalem...

I would rather be Satan's Whore than the Brie of Christ!
 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489


Choking on Satan's cock for all eternity doesn't sound that appealing to me.

But, hey, different strokes for different strokes.

You do you, Boo.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


Do not be rude to the Daughter of the Living Goddess and the Princess of the Universe.
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:46 PM
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The ass licking complaint Nazarene said; "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's; and render unto God what is God's".

 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489

Sounds like you've never had a legit interaction with Him.

If so, you would have written, "The ass kicking Nazarene said..."

Just an observation.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


Lolz...he died in ignominy on a tree outside Jerusalem...

I would rather be Satan's Whore than the Brie of Christ!
 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489


Choking on Satan's cock for all eternity doesn't sound that appealing to me.

But, hey, different strokes for different strokes.

You do you, Boo.
 Quoting: AnneFranksDrumKit


Do not be rude to the Daughter of the Living Goddess and the Princess of the Universe.
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:48 PM
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Governments adapt

The old woman who pestered the judge proves it

Pray pray and pray more and more to God until he gives you your prayer

Pester the heck out of God wiith prayer until like the judge. He relents
 Quoting: hwy_ho


On "Prayer":

What kind of fool beesecheth his tormentor for mercy; for if thy tormentor were indeed capable of extending mercy; he would not be called thy tormentor; now would he!
chauchat

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11/14/2020 01:51 PM
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I have nearly completed calculations of wealth destroyed from usury in two thousand and twenty years. It does include results for both straight loss, but also loss plus compounded interest.

I am deeply concerned at the preliminary results, however, because the debt does not appear to be repayable.
 Quoting: BathMoy 78685944


We've been sold into slavery to sin and death and debt that we have no hope of repaying.
YET [?]---
Psalm 49
5 Why should I fear during times of trouble,

When I am surrounded by the evil of those trying to overthrow me?

6 Those who are trusting in their wealth

And who boast about their great riches,

7 None of them can ever redeem a brother

Or give to God a ransom for him,

8 (The ransom price for their life is so precious

That it is always beyond their reach);


9 That he should live forever and not see the pit.

10 He sees that even wise people die;

The stupid and the unreasoning perish together,

And they must leave their wealth to others.

11 Their inner wish is that their houses will last forever,

Their tents to generation after generation.

They have named their estates after themselves.

12 But man, although honored, will not remain;

He is no better than the beasts that perish.

13 This is the way of the stupid ones

And of those who follow them, who take pleasure in their empty words. (Selah)



As used in the Bible, “atonement” has the basic thought of “cover” or “exchange,” and that which is given in exchange for, or as a “cover” for, another thing must be its duplicate. Thus, anything making satisfaction for something that is lost or forfeited must be “at one” with that other thing, completely covering it as its exact equivalent. There must be no overlapping and no coming short.

No imperfect human could provide such a covering or atonement to restore perfect human life to any or all of mankind. (Ps 49:7, 8) To make adequate atonement for what was forfeited by Adam, a sin offering having the precise value of a perfect human life would have to be provided.
Daughter of Satan
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11/14/2020 01:53 PM
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Governments adapt

The old woman who pestered the judge proves it

Pray pray and pray more and more to God until he gives you your prayer

Pester the heck out of God wiith prayer until like the judge. He relents
 Quoting: hwy_ho


On "Prayer":

What kind of fool beesecheth his tormentor for mercy; for if thy tormentor were indeed capable of extending mercy; he would not be called thy tormentor; now would he!
 Quoting: Daughter of Satan 13188489


I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and CREATE EVIL; I the Lord do all these things.
___Isaiah 45:7

At least He admits it!
cclawnman

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11/14/2020 01:59 PM

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Lawless begats lawless
43 Green

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11/14/2020 02:04 PM
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Paul was a false apostle. Discard anything and everything that he says.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 79234724


Your God isn’t big enough. God from His throne saw that the teachings of Paul were in His Word. Don’t ignore what will help you to know God. Unless you want to, then that’s on you.





GLP