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| 11:51 PM | ||
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Why did AMTRAK 188 train derail BEFORE REACHING THAT CURVE? | |
| Esoteric Morgan
...in awe of many things  User ID: 68626197  United States05/14/2015 07:51 PM  Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Brian8888
User ID: 68643185 United States05/14/2015 07:53 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [link to i1377.photobucket.com] The FBI knew Story by ABC news about 9 stolen train derailers written on May 8, 2015.. Last Edited by Brian8888 on 05/14/2015 08:44 PM YOU ARE ME |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5870241 United States05/14/2015 07:55 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| SeVeN Saints
User ID: 67692036 United States05/14/2015 07:56 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5870241 United States05/14/2015 08:00 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 69227819  Russia05/14/2015 08:03 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Copernica
User ID: 17525775 United States05/14/2015 08:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I agree op. The dark gash is very clear and easy to follow. I suppose an argument could be made that it was the very start of the curve and at that speed, may have been enough to send it off the rails? But the ABC News article about the derailers being stolen is interesting, especially if it's from May 8th of this year. What I'm not understanding are the explosions seen on the security cam video. What caused those? God Bless President TRUMP! GOD BLESS AMERICA!! |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Since reading about that warning, I've even started to wonder about all the NYC OEM notification emails I've been receiving the past few weeks. They usually concern Metro North, or some other train line, experiencing delays 'due to police activity'. Until this Amtrak tragedy, I never gave them a second thought. thanks for adding that! -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| Brian8888
User ID: 68643185 United States05/14/2015 08:09 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Since reading about that warning, I've even started to wonder about all the NYC OEM notification emails I've been receiving the past few weeks. They usually concern Metro North, or some other train line, experiencing delays 'due to police activity'. Until this Amtrak tragedy, I never gave them a second thought. thanks for adding that! I caught it on the Kev Baker utube channel Hope it clarifies things YOU ARE ME |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:19 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | a famous derailment in spain has the engine clearing the turn then the 3rd car down 'bounces' inexplicably....only then does the whole train derail... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5870241 I think that third car had help The day picture seems to have a good deal of information hidden in it. It's my hope that some of the people commenting will look at that picture, and try to visualize how that car alone became mangled. We can see that the engine landed on it's own, after hitting the tracks on the other rail lines. The answers to what happened to the second car may be all the way down the tracks past the last car. In a derailed train traveling at momentum, how does one car pop off? Could it have been crushed by the engine and third car, then pop off? We really need to diagnose this event by attempting to rule out what's implausible, against what is plausible. Thanks. -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| beeches
User ID: 28167778 United States05/14/2015 08:23 PM  Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Wow! I'm glad you found that video; thanks. There we have a high speed-train ~50% through a semi-circular bend. Hopefully, people with keen with insight can compare what happened in that video to the Amtrak accident. -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 42634866 United States05/14/2015 08:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | This thread was prompted by the following post; it deserves its own thread: Quoting: Esoteric Morgan Thread: The Amtrak Crash: Why The FBI Lied And Why It Is No Freak Accident Lending The Possibility Of A Terror Attack (Page 42) First, AC 59795891 posted both the security video of the train passing moments before derailment, and the daytime picture earlier this evening...which prompted me to scrutinize them both...as written in my reply. I hardly ever start threads, but I'm afraid this will get buried, without people having had a chance to see things which may be contrary to the official report...and what MSM is not discussing. Compare these two hi res photos: Quoting: Anonymous Coward 59795891 Night shot showing tanker only feet away from Amtrak engine: [link to content-img.newsinc.com] Day shot showing exactly where that tanker car was. Tanker car (and others connected to it) are gone, and the Amtrak engine is being moved, but you can see exactly where both were, using the damaged, bent track as a reference point: [link to www.msnbc.com] Can someone please scrutinize that day shot? I mean really follow the alleged turn the train supposedly make? THIS PICTURE SEEMS TO INDICATE THE TRAIN NEVER MADE THE TURN If you look at the last car -then follow the tracks themselves forward- you will notice that the train had to have started to derail BEHIND to where that last car is shown...which is BEFORE the curve in the cracks. Had it taken the turn, it would have been INSIDE those vertical poles -which remain intact. Now, go back and look at which vertical pole is totaled; it is BEHIND that last car, and there's a long visible groove in the dirt further behind that last car. SEE WHERE THOSE MEN ARE WORKING all by themselves? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE SCRUTINIZE THIS? The night video clearly shows the train passing, and shortly afterwards a series of bright flashes followed by either smoke or dust clouds trailing back to the cam view. The excellent aerial day shot shows the entire aftermath shot, beyond what we've seen before. Can everyone please scrutinize what these are actually showing, especially the daytime shot of the aftermath? I mean really follow the alleged turn the train supposedly make? The purpose of this thread is to discuss whether this train ever attempted the turn, using the picture as reference... The aftermath picture clearly shows various people working in the track area further behind that last car. I'd like people's opinion of what the picture is showing, and what seems to have happen, including other points I raised in my reply. Speed? Or could it have been something else? I'm still not satisfied with what is now being reported, and no one seems to have address those flashes in the night video. Thank you. The flashes are from the pantograph as the train derails. The train did not derail in the curve. It derailed as it entered the curve, following the law of motion that states that an object in motion stays in motion until acted upon by an outside force. Under normal circumstances, the oustide force would have been the curve, but the excessive speed of the train kept the train going in a straight line and it literally pushed the rail right off the ties. |
| Copernica
User ID: 17525775 United States05/14/2015 08:28 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | a famous derailment in spain has the engine clearing the turn then the 3rd car down 'bounces' inexplicably....only then does the whole train derail... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5870241 I think that third car had help The day picture seems to have a good deal of information hidden in it. It's my hope that some of the people commenting will look at that picture, and try to visualize how that car alone became mangled. We can see that the engine landed on it's own, after hitting the tracks on the other rail lines. The answers to what happened to the second car may be all the way down the tracks past the last car. In a derailed train traveling at momentum, how does one car pop off? Could it have been crushed by the engine and third car, then pop off? We really need to diagnose this event by attempting to rule out what's implausible, against what is plausible. Thanks. Have you ever had a toy train? Mine would always derail and most of the time the engine stayed on the rails. The engine is the heaviest part of the train, so harder to derail. Then you have the whole whip lash thing happening with the other cars. The 1st car is only going to derail from the back side first as it's too close to the more stable engine at the front. The 2nd car is the first part of the train that would derail from the front, yanking all the cars behind with it and pulling the first car from it's back. With the forward momentum of all the cars and the angles, the 1st train car would be the most smooshed up one as it would get the full velocity of the 3rd car and beyond. I think. God Bless President TRUMP! GOD BLESS AMERICA!! |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:35 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I agree op. The dark gash is very clear and easy to follow. Quoting: Copernica I suppose an argument could be made that it was the very start of the curve and at that speed, may have been enough to send it off the rails? But the ABC News article about the derailers being stolen is interesting, especially if it's from May 8th of this year. What I'm not understanding are the explosions seen on the security cam video. What caused those? I do understand the question of excessive speed going into a turn, but I also remember the many interviews of passengers, not one of them questioning high speed. The consensus seemed to be that the train was doing under 50 miles an hour. As I watched 4 different network anchors discuss this, well past 4 a.m., none of the interviews focused on excessive speed as the reason. The stolen derailers are still a TBD issue; it seems no one is talking about that point either. As far as the possible 'explosions' are concerned, the first I heard this was in the AC comment which led to this thread. Well, that first night there were locals who thought they heard something, and at least one passenger who mentioned flashes. Then, nothing. Good points! -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:39 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | That what I thought. There's appears to be loose ends that MSM is not questioning. Yet, here we are, raising questions alone...based on their OWN pictures and early reporting.  -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 42634866 United States05/14/2015 08:41 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I agree op. The dark gash is very clear and easy to follow. Quoting: Copernica I suppose an argument could be made that it was the very start of the curve and at that speed, may have been enough to send it off the rails? But the ABC News article about the derailers being stolen is interesting, especially if it's from May 8th of this year. What I'm not understanding are the explosions seen on the security cam video. What caused those? I do understand the question of excessive speed going into a turn, but I also remember the many interviews of passengers, not one of them questioning high speed. The consensus seemed to be that the train was doing under 50 miles an hour. As I watched 4 different network anchors discuss this, well past 4 a.m., none of the interviews focused on excessive speed as the reason. The stolen derailers are still a TBD issue; it seems no one is talking about that point either. As far as the possible 'explosions' are concerned, the first I heard this was in the AC comment which led to this thread. Well, that first night there were locals who thought they heard something, and at least one passenger who mentioned flashes. Then, nothing. Good points! OP, I had not heard about the stolen derailers. Could you give me a brief. |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:49 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The flashes are from the pantograph as the train derails. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42634866 The train did not derail in the curve. It derailed as it entered the curve, following the law of motion that states that an object in motion stays in motion until acted upon by an outside force. Under normal circumstances, the oustide force would have been the curve, but the excessive speed of the train kept the train going in a straight line and it literally pushed the rail right off the ties. Thank you for explaining this. It would be so much easier to understand and accept if the networks were showing models. Could the train have reached such an excessive speed so soon after leaving the station? Have you looked at what appears like a contained 'debris' (?) field further back from the last car, past the grooving the train made after leaving the tracks? I guess I'm looking to rule out foul play, but until I understand the speed issue -which seems to discount what witnesses reported- my mind won't rest. One other thing, AC... Do you have an opinion as to how the 2nd car wound up like that? -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 08:58 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | a famous derailment in spain has the engine clearing the turn then the 3rd car down 'bounces' inexplicably....only then does the whole train derail... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5870241 I think that third car had help The day picture seems to have a good deal of information hidden in it. It's my hope that some of the people commenting will look at that picture, and try to visualize how that car alone became mangled. We can see that the engine landed on it's own, after hitting the tracks on the other rail lines. The answers to what happened to the second car may be all the way down the tracks past the last car. In a derailed train traveling at momentum, how does one car pop off? Could it have been crushed by the engine and third car, then pop off? We really need to diagnose this event by attempting to rule out what's implausible, against what is plausible. Thanks. Have you ever had a toy train? Mine would always derail and most of the time the engine stayed on the rails. The engine is the heaviest part of the train, so harder to derail. Then you have the whole whip lash thing happening with the other cars. The 1st car is only going to derail from the back side first as it's too close to the more stable engine at the front. The 2nd car is the first part of the train that would derail from the front, yanking all the cars behind with it and pulling the first car from it's back. With the forward momentum of all the cars and the angles, the 1st train car would be the most smooshed up one as it would get the full velocity of the 3rd car and beyond. I think. Thanks for that. I think I will wind up reading your comment over and over until I can 'see' it in my mind, against that daytime picture. I appreciate your input! -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| CE1
***** User ID: 69208230 United States05/14/2015 09:01 PM  Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| dmhennen
User ID: 16347111 United States05/14/2015 09:03 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It was going over 2X the speed it was supposed to be going. Not be surprising if if came off the rails at the VERY beginning of the curve Quoting: SeVeN Saints Was it going 2x the speed? The NTSB said that, BUT the crash would look far worse if this train was traveling this fast. I believe it WAS moving around 50 mph when it blew up, causing the derailment. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 33435073 United States05/14/2015 09:03 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 69227762 United States05/14/2015 09:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The flashes are from the pantograph as the train derails. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42634866 The train did not derail in the curve. It derailed as it entered the curve, following the law of motion that states that an object in motion stays in motion until acted upon by an outside force. Under normal circumstances, the oustide force would have been the curve, but the excessive speed of the train kept the train going in a straight line and it literally pushed the rail right off the ties. Thank you for explaining this. It would be so much easier to understand and accept if the networks were showing models. Could the train have reached such an excessive speed so soon after leaving the station? Have you looked at what appears like a contained 'debris' (?) field further back from the last car, past the grooving the train made after leaving the tracks? I guess I'm looking to rule out foul play, but until I understand the speed issue -which seems to discount what witnesses reported- my mind won't rest. One other thing, AC... Do you have an opinion as to how the 2nd car wound up like that? Foul play is certainly an issue, considering that moments before this crash a SEPTA train reported an object being thrown in its direction. Regarding the 2nd car, I am not sure what the question was, but if it is regarding the utter devastation suffered by the cars on the head end, that appears to have been the result of being sliced open by a catenary pole. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 69199720 United States05/14/2015 09:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | This thread was prompted by the following post; it deserves its own thread: Quoting: Esoteric Morgan Thread: The Amtrak Crash: Why The FBI Lied And Why It Is No Freak Accident Lending The Possibility Of A Terror Attack (Page 42) First, AC 59795891 posted both the security video of the train passing moments before derailment, and the daytime picture earlier this evening...which prompted me to scrutinize them both...as written in my reply. I hardly ever start threads, but I'm afraid this will get buried, without people having had a chance to see things which may be contrary to the official report...and what MSM is not discussing. Compare these two hi res photos: Quoting: Anonymous Coward 59795891 Night shot showing tanker only feet away from Amtrak engine: [link to content-img.newsinc.com] Day shot showing exactly where that tanker car was. Tanker car (and others connected to it) are gone, and the Amtrak engine is being moved, but you can see exactly where both were, using the damaged, bent track as a reference point: [link to www.msnbc.com] Can someone please scrutinize that day shot? I mean really follow the alleged turn the train supposedly make? THIS PICTURE SEEMS TO INDICATE THE TRAIN NEVER MADE THE TURN If you look at the last car -then follow the tracks themselves forward- you will notice that the train had to have started to derail BEHIND to where that last car is shown...which is BEFORE the curve in the cracks. Had it taken the turn, it would have been INSIDE those vertical poles -which remain intact. Now, go back and look at which vertical pole is totaled; it is BEHIND that last car, and there's a long visible groove in the dirt further behind that last car. SEE WHERE THOSE MEN ARE WORKING all by themselves? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE SCRUTINIZE THIS? The night video clearly shows the train passing, and shortly afterwards a series of bright flashes followed by either smoke or dust clouds trailing back to the cam view. The excellent aerial day shot shows the entire aftermath shot, beyond what we've seen before. Can everyone please scrutinize what these are actually showing, especially the daytime shot of the aftermath? I mean really follow the alleged turn the train supposedly make? The purpose of this thread is to discuss whether this train ever attempted the turn, using the picture as reference... The aftermath picture clearly shows various people working in the track area further behind that last car. I'd like people's opinion of what the picture is showing, and what seems to have happen, including other points I raised in my reply. Speed? Or could it have been something else? I'm still not satisfied with what is now being reported, and no one seems to have address those flashes in the night video. Thank you. I'd prefer to wait for an investigation from people that know what they are doing, have access to experts, the data, and the physical evidence. But please go ahead with your Hardy Boys effort. |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 09:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [link to i1377.photobucket.com] Quoting: Brian8888 The FBI knew Story by ABC news about 9 stolen train derailers written on May 8, 2015.. I agree op. The dark gash is very clear and easy to follow. Quoting: Copernica I suppose an argument could be made that it was the very start of the curve and at that speed, may have been enough to send it off the rails? But the ABC News article about the derailers being stolen is interesting, especially if it's from May 8th of this year. What I'm not understanding are the explosions seen on the security cam video. What caused those? I do understand the question of excessive speed going into a turn, but I also remember the many interviews of passengers, not one of them questioning high speed. The consensus seemed to be that the train was doing under 50 miles an hour. As I watched 4 different network anchors discuss this, well past 4 a.m., none of the interviews focused on excessive speed as the reason. The stolen derailers are still a TBD issue; it seems no one is talking about that point either. As far as the possible 'explosions' are concerned, the first I heard this was in the AC comment which led to this thread. Well, that first night there were locals who thought they heard something, and at least one passenger who mentioned flashes. Then, nothing. Good points! OP, I had not heard about the stolen derailers. Could you give me a brief. Brian8888 mentioned them in the beginning of the thread. Here's the ABC article: [link to abcnews.go.com] Excerpts: FBI Warns of Train Derailment Threat Washington, May 8 "Nine derailers, a piece of railroad equipment used to derail train cars for safety purposes in railyards have been stolen recently, sources said, citing the FBI's weekly intelligence bulletin. The theft of these items is strange since they are of little use outside of the rail industry, according to the bulletin." "The bulletin does not mention a specific threat, and the FBI has no indication the derail thefts are related to terrorism. The bulletin is distributed weekly to 18,000 state and local law enforcement agencies around the United States" -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 846509 United States05/14/2015 09:12 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Conductor is a satanist or a theosophist. Conductor was possessed (by aliens) at the time. This is GLP, I can say that here. Magick did it. They're going to spin it as temporary insanity. He just cranked up the speed of the thing, he was hypnotized. It has to do with New York. Maybe it didn't derail before the curve. I've discovered through abnormal news there is a follow up team of DHSers that hoax the scene to confuse evidence and try to make it so their infrastructure they guard doesn't have to pay money to victims in court. Maybe this is disinfo, I don't know. Yeah it's piss off everybody day. Just a theory, magic created MK ultra sort of brainwashing. |
| OneofThem
User ID: 69187771 United States05/14/2015 09:15 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I agree op. The dark gash is very clear and easy to follow. Quoting: Copernica I suppose an argument could be made that it was the very start of the curve and at that speed, may have been enough to send it off the rails? But the ABC News article about the derailers being stolen is interesting, especially if it's from May 8th of this year. What I'm not understanding are the explosions seen on the security cam video. What caused those? Probably the same thing that caused the other commuter train down the tracks from this one ( just moments before this one crashed) that busted out the engineers window. The one car that is totally trashed makes no sense, why would this car be smashed to smitherenes and the others are just turned on their sides??? Since when does AMTAK do 100 MPH? I rode one three yrs ago from south florida to western maryland and i bet we never went over 35-40 MPH. Now, the freighters that we had to constantly keep pulling over for, they go probably 60 MPH. We are supposed to gullibly beLIEve the phony story they push.....yea ok....gimme a break, puhleeze!!! I'm sure a lot of folks beLIEve the officials but there are many of us ON TO THEM and don't fall for their BS. Last Edited by Rising Ea Star on 05/14/2015 09:18 PM “He who does not seek.... is not likely to find.” - Paracelsus Those who refuse to Self Govern will always be Governed by Others! “The secret of change is to focus all of your energy, not on fighting the old, but on building the new.” – Socrates |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 846509 United States05/14/2015 09:17 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | 9 Derailers stolen? Wasn't there a guy who wanted to make the fastest train transport across usa? Some Musk guy? This thievery and sabotage now, maybe it's to make him look bad, or to provoke a desire to have better or worse technology? Hypothesis: What if Amtrak did it to themselves to keep Amtrak and remove his technology? Because they don't want amtrak to be replaced. Funny because throughout the decades, every time there has been some rumors about taking away Amtrak, theres like, this disaster and it makes the government want to reinforce Amtrak not the people who want to replace it with something better, like a magnetic rail. |
| mentallyunst@ble
User ID: 60351091  Canada05/14/2015 09:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | wait what? I thought it happened in Philly?? and I thought it was only 8 killed?? Last Edited by mentallyunst@ble on 05/14/2015 09:26 PM Your worst nightmare |
| Esoteric Morgan
(OP) ...in awe of many things User ID: 68626197 United States05/14/2015 09:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I'd prefer to wait for an investigation from people that know what they are doing, have access to experts, the data, and the physical evidence. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69199720 But please go ahead with your Hardy Boys effort. Hardy Boy detective work or not, with little explanation out there except: Oh! It was the conductors fault, going at excessive speed. while discounting conflicting info, I'm sure I'm not the only one wondering about the other things that conflict. Are we getting so use to hearing official statements within hours that we take them for granted? Even before investigations have barely been started. I can think of number of tragedies through the years where the immediately named cause was later discounted, or challenged for many years after-the-fact. I just need to ease my own mind and emotions. People on here are helping me do that. -- TRUST THE PLAN -- .......WWG1WGA...... ____________________________ still in awe of many things |
| ThereRMeds4That
User ID: 68649948 United States05/14/2015 09:29 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | OP, I would recommend that you read over this thread from another forum. A lot of good info in here from knowledgable sources. I believe it may answer some of your questions. Esp regarding the decimated car and physics of a derailment. [link to discuss.amtraktrains.com] Probably want to start at the beginning of the thread. Some Shepherds remain hidden from their sheep. |
