The TSHTF guide to fish and bird antibiotics | |
508527
User ID: 1432018 United States 01/22/2013 11:10 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | You prepper-tards will self dose and make yourselves deaf, fry your livers, induce serious diarrhea and resulting dehydration or even kill yourselves outright because of incorrect antibiotic use. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28070593 There is a reason doctors, pharmacists and medical scientists spend years studying this stuff, its fucking complicated, meaning you cant just wing it. Antibiotics can be dangerous medications, its not like using aspirin, you really have to know what you are doing. I have 5 years of microbiology, specifically bacteriology education under my belt and even have experience in antimicrobial compound research... and unless it was SHTF i wouldn't be comfortable self dosing or even dosing others unless they had serious signs of say an anerobic wound infection which would probably lead to gangrene without treatment. stfu doc-shill |
Eagle # 1 User ID: 31897366 United States 01/22/2013 11:15 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | HI, Emerald eye ! So VERY NICE to have you back ! Have been giving references/information about your wonderful "Symptoms of Radiation Sickness ", you posted back in March of 2011. I had my grandson type them all out from a list I copied, and we printed them up for the whole family and some friends. As there is continuous/increasing fallout from Fukushima lately, as shown by my survey meter, (that ONLY reads gamma), and especially in the milk from Stop&Shop)), I tried to warn those not here in 2011. As it HAS been 22 months since the radiation started to fall, I believe we are passing into the CUMULATIVE DOSE of radiation passing the 50 Rems/Rads that brings ON the symptoms, including " Flu-like symptoms ". Having contracted that last week, with NO FEVER, I suspect I have passed that marker myself, even though I have been using about 5-6 ways you recommended, for riding the body of same, blocks absorption of same or interfering with uptake of same. Eagle |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 17851333 United States 01/22/2013 11:22 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | For entertainment purposes only and not meant as veterinarian advice or medical advice: For cats with colds (upper respiratory infection) 50mg of amoxycillin 2 times a day. 10 to 14 days. Dose of Flagyl for cats with diarrhea is 40 mg 2 times a day. FIVE DAYS ONLY! Do not give longer without vet approval. Doxycycline will become toxic after the expiration date. This is one anti-biotic that does not just become weaker with age. Throw it out if it is past the date on the bottle. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 17851333 United States 01/22/2013 11:24 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | For entertainment purposes only and not meant as veterinarian advice or medical advice: Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17851333 For cats with colds (upper respiratory infection) 50mg of amoxycillin 2 times a day. 10 to 14 days. Dose of Flagyl for cats with diarrhea is 40 mg 2 times a day. FIVE DAYS ONLY! Do not give longer without vet approval. Doxycycline will become toxic after the expiration date. This is one anti-biotic that does not just become weaker with age. Throw it out if it is past the date on the bottle. Dosage above is for adult cats, not kittens. Do not increase dosage for weight. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1540313 United States 01/22/2013 11:36 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 28070593 United Kingdom 01/22/2013 11:36 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | You prepper-tards will self dose and make yourselves deaf, fry your livers, induce serious diarrhea and resulting dehydration or even kill yourselves outright because of incorrect antibiotic use. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28070593 There is a reason doctors, pharmacists and medical scientists spend years studying this stuff, its fucking complicated, meaning you cant just wing it. Antibiotics can be dangerous medications, its not like using aspirin, you really have to know what you are doing. I have 5 years of microbiology, specifically bacteriology education under my belt and even have experience in antimicrobial compound research... and unless it was SHTF i wouldn't be comfortable self dosing or even dosing others unless they had serious signs of say an anerobic wound infection which would probably lead to gangrene without treatment. stfu doc-shill Not a doctor, a microbiologist. Look, I dont care if you accidentally induce partial deafness because you took Cipro for only two or three days, im just trying to warn you and others in this thread that antibiotic use is not as simple as you think. No medication is 100% safe, and antibiotics are some of the more dangerous medications. You guys just need to know this is not a risk free practice. I admire your will to be self sufficient and protect you and yours, but naivety is dangerous, ignorance is fatal. |
Epic Beard Guy
User ID: 26240425 United States 01/22/2013 11:37 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | You prepper-tards will self dose and make yourselves deaf, fry your livers, induce serious diarrhea and resulting dehydration or even kill yourselves outright because of incorrect antibiotic use. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28070593 There is a reason doctors, pharmacists and medical scientists spend years studying this stuff, its fucking complicated, meaning you cant just wing it. Antibiotics can be dangerous medications, its not like using aspirin, you really have to know what you are doing. I have 5 years of microbiology, specifically bacteriology education under my belt and even have experience in antimicrobial compound research... and unless it was SHTF i wouldn't be comfortable self dosing or even dosing others unless they had serious signs of say an anerobic wound infection which would probably lead to gangrene without treatment. Not likely. It's not like we're brits or something. In America we are smart enough to follow instructions like Emerald Eye is giving here. I have used fish antibiotics with no adverse effects at all. I would not reccommend them to anyone with an IQ in the single digits, so you should probably not try it. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 31759258 United States 01/22/2013 11:40 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 28070593 United Kingdom 01/22/2013 11:49 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Tetracyclines cause chelation of calcium ions therefore a build up in bones and teeth. But yellowing of teeth is the least of your SHTF worries. Hepatoxicity and bone deformites are a risk. Even if it is low. Risk worth taking if you have a severe respiratory infection, exposure to, lyme, lepto etc. This is a very very complicated risk assesment situation you guys are talking about. Still, suprainfection and vitamin b deficiency are much more likely with tetcycs, especially given expected post SHTF malnutrition and stress. And thats just one class of antibiotic. Penicillin allergies are quite common even if pencillin is often fairly safe. Chloramphenicol and all amphenicols pose issues relating to bone marrow. Jaundice with Macrolides etc. Just letting you guys know that even using some antibiotics for even a couple of days can have serious side effects. Please be careful. |
Epic Beard Guy
User ID: 26240425 United States 01/22/2013 11:49 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | the pitty is, you get them easily anywhere but in Germany. Quoting: phoenixe any advice/suggestions how to get them here? You can buy them on Ebay, or any pet supply store on line. I don't know about shipping them to Germany, but generally th seller doesn't care where they send them. If they wont ship there, have them sent to a freind or family outside Germany, then ship as private package without seller's info on box. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 32771247 United States 01/22/2013 11:51 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | You prepper-tards will self dose and make yourselves deaf, fry your livers, induce serious diarrhea and resulting dehydration or even kill yourselves outright because of incorrect antibiotic use. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28070593 There is a reason doctors, pharmacists and medical scientists spend years studying this stuff, its fucking complicated, meaning you cant just wing it. Antibiotics can be dangerous medications, its not like using aspirin, you really have to know what you are doing. I have 5 years of microbiology, specifically bacteriology education under my belt and even have experience in antimicrobial compound research... and unless it was SHTF i wouldn't be comfortable self dosing or even dosing others unless they had serious signs of say an anerobic wound infection which would probably lead to gangrene without treatment. So what? It's our bodies and our choices and our consequences. Most of us can research quite well and have a healthy respect for consequences. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 28070593 United Kingdom 01/22/2013 11:51 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1310640 United States 01/22/2013 11:51 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
TruthBeGone
User ID: 8379586 United States 01/22/2013 11:54 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 23318413 United States 01/22/2013 11:54 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Epic Beard Guy
User ID: 26240425 United States 01/22/2013 11:58 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Tetracyclines cause chelation of calcium ions therefore a build up in bones and teeth. But yellowing of teeth is the least of your SHTF worries. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28070593 Hepatoxicity and bone deformites are a risk. Even if it is low. Risk worth taking if you have a severe respiratory infection, exposure to, lyme, lepto etc. This is a very very complicated risk assesment situation you guys are talking about. Still, suprainfection and vitamin b deficiency are much more likely with tetcycs, especially given expected post SHTF malnutrition and stress. And thats just one class of antibiotic. Penicillin allergies are quite common even if pencillin is often fairly safe. Chloramphenicol and all amphenicols pose issues relating to bone marrow. Jaundice with Macrolides etc. Just letting you guys know that even using some antibiotics for even a couple of days can have serious side effects. Please be careful. Yellowing of teeth from Tetracycline is only a problem for children with teeth still forming. This yellowing is alll the way through. You can have your teeth whitened, but it wont last long. A good dental whitening at the dentist office might last a year. All the whitening procedures are developed for teeth with surface staining. I had a dentist tell me that the stain can't go all the way through. I told him to look it up. He did, and he apologized. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 28070593 United Kingdom 01/22/2013 12:00 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Not likely. It's not like we're brits or something. In America we are smart enough to follow instructions like Emerald Eye is giving here. I have used fish antibiotics with no adverse effects at all. I would not reccommend them to anyone with an IQ in the single digits, so you should probably not try it. Quoting: Epic Beard Guy Whilst i appreciate and respect the good intentions of everybody in this thread, if you cant grasp the simple idea that somebody with half a decades experience with microbiology is saying this is pretty dangerous practice guys, and you all aught to be very very careful.. well its your funeral. I'm not saying absolutely 100% dont ever do this, im saying, be very very fucking careful. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 31897366 United States 01/22/2013 12:01 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
emerald eye
(OP) Keeping an "eye out" for the truth. User ID: 847075 United States 01/22/2013 12:11 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Many thanks to whoever green pinned this...I didn't think it would get much attention, but I do feel the information is important, mainly for entertainment and discussion reasons of course. To those of you who have said that antibiotics can kill you, you are absolutely correct. Even in the hands of qualified professionals, there can be serious and even fatal adverse effects with the use of antibiotics. The reason that I decided to post this information is that in true a SHTF situation, people are less likely to use them incorrectly if they have some basic information, and know some of the indications for use and also some of what to watch out for. The bottom line is that with even a little information, antibiotics are less likely to kill you than with no information at all in a desperate situation. Of course there is no way that a small list like this can be all inclusive, and no one should take any antibiotic not supervised by a competent health care provider in normal circumstances. Therefore this discussion is entirely fictional for the fictional world in which there is no access to a competent health care provider. May that situation always stay within the realm of fiction.... To those of you who asked about radiation, here is an old thread of mine.... Thread: **RADIATION PROTECTION**- non prescription list, revised and updated. Good luck to us all... Courage forges a path through all obstacles, while fear is the obstruction of all dreams. The only way that anyone gets something for nothing, is that someone else has given up something for nothing. |
Mister_Worlwide
User ID: 26282771 United States 01/22/2013 12:19 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Epic Beard Guy
User ID: 26240425 United States 01/22/2013 12:20 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Not likely. It's not like we're brits or something. In America we are smart enough to follow instructions like Emerald Eye is giving here. I have used fish antibiotics with no adverse effects at all. I would not reccommend them to anyone with an IQ in the single digits, so you should probably not try it. Quoting: Epic Beard Guy Whilst i appreciate and respect the good intentions of everybody in this thread, if you cant grasp the simple idea that somebody with half a decades experience with microbiology is saying this is pretty dangerous practice guys, and you all aught to be very very careful.. well its your funeral. I'm not saying absolutely 100% dont ever do this, im saying, be very very fucking careful. Nobody should ever take any medication wihout knowing all the facts, but in an emergency you may have to take care of yourself. If anyone in my family was very sick, and no medical services available, I'd have to figure out the correct dose and give them antibiotics. This thread gives us the info we can use to do that safely. You can do what ever you want with that info, but I will keep it close to the meds. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 31897366 United States 01/22/2013 12:21 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1730008 United States 01/22/2013 12:23 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Hi There, I had an adverse reaction to levaquin. It is of the "Fluoroquinolone" variety of anti-biotic. [link to articles.mercola.com] I ended up in severe pain and unable to walk for days. I still have pain and cramps from these things. Some people end up with tendonitis or torn ligaments from Fluoroquinolones. I doubt I would touch them again.... |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1310640 United States 01/22/2013 12:35 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
cabbage_goddess
User ID: 19207131 United States 01/22/2013 12:54 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | There is some great information here... Quoting: MissionInvisible I have not had time to read through all of it (as I want to comb through the websites listed as well). Do you have a top 2-3 (broad spectrum antibiotics) that you would recommend if you had to pick just a few? This is a tough question. I narrowed it down to the following in the above: First the disclaimer: The following is for entertainment and discussion purposes, ONLY seek professional medical guidance before attempting to diagnose or treat any condition. The same rules apply to veterinary medicine. Also, I do not recommend the ingestion of any product not specifically manufactured for human use, unless it is an emergency situation, and no other viable alternative exists. In addition, people with kidney, liver problems ,and many other serious health issues may be at increased risk while using antibiotics and should consult with a qualified health care provider prior to considering any antibiotic usage. Some medications may also adversely interact with antibiotics and these should be discussed with your health care provider prior to considering any antibiotic usage. 3. In stocking a medical BOB on a limited budget, I would pick first Cephalexin (Keflex), second Metronidazole (Flagyl), third Erythromycin or azithromycin (Zithromax) if you can afford the more expensive of the two, fourth Sulfamethoxazole and trimethoprim (Septra DS, Bactrim DS). and fifth Ciprofloxin or Doxycycline. No matter what my budget, I would make sure to have Florastor. Those are my picks, but you should check with your health care provider to see if you or people in your family have and counterindications to any of these, and then choose accordingly. To narrow further to just 2 or three, my first pick would always be Cephalexin (Keflex) followed by Metronidazole (Fagyl). They are both broad spectrum, and Keflex is usually very easily tolerated and kids, pregnant women and dogs can usually take it. The Metronidazole covers anaerobic infections such as abscesses, MRSA, and would help if someone came down with C Diff. The Erythryomcin or Zithromax would be extremely valuable for respiratory infections. So that is a must have as well, and maybe should even be bumped to second. That is as small as I can pare the list down.... Sorry. Thank you - my husband and I had been talking about this and I had narrowed down the list to the ones you said, in the order you said (except clindamycin last on my list). This was very helpful! 5* to you, OP!! Formerly faint |
Morpheus
User ID: 729560 Canada 01/22/2013 01:05 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | You prepper-tards will self dose and make yourselves deaf, fry your livers, induce serious diarrhea and resulting dehydration or even kill yourselves outright because of incorrect antibiotic use. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28070593 There is a reason doctors, pharmacists and medical scientists spend years studying this stuff, its fucking complicated, meaning you cant just wing it. Antibiotics can be dangerous medications, its not like using aspirin, you really have to know what you are doing. I have 5 years of microbiology, specifically bacteriology education under my belt and even have experience in antimicrobial compound research... and unless it was SHTF i wouldn't be comfortable self dosing or even dosing others unless they had serious signs of say an anerobic wound infection which would probably lead to gangrene without treatment. stfu doc-shill Not a doctor, a microbiologist. Look, I dont care if you accidentally induce partial deafness because you took Cipro for only two or three days, im just trying to warn you and others in this thread that antibiotic use is not as simple as you think. No medication is 100% safe, and antibiotics are some of the more dangerous medications. You guys just need to know this is not a risk free practice. I admire your will to be self sufficient and protect you and yours, but naivety is dangerous, ignorance is fatal. You made a comment about Cipro inducing deafness if taken for 2 or 3 days. Why don't you fully explain yourself ? It's easy to criticize but why not educate us with what you know ? |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 32805102 United States 01/22/2013 01:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I asked my doctor one day about his. So I wasn't too crazy because he's had the question before. Quoting: PENG So he says, yeah, in general they can be used as it obviously is the antibiotic humans use. Only two things he mentioned: 1 was the pharmaceutical quality, where they are manufactured. The standards are not the same (think meningitis), and 2: the biggest difference are the binding agents. Fish meds are meant to be dissolved in water and the binding agent is very different than human meds as we have acid to break down the meds. So he said dosing is very difficult. Usually the problem is that by the time you would take your last dosage, because of the different binding agent, the first dosage would just be taking effect. He didn't seem concerned about the actual danger, just the effectiveness. But, if things really really really got bad, it's worth a stab I suppose. I just wouldn't be taking them to save money. Lol. In many cases there is a number on the pill that you can look up online to see where it is manufactured. I tried this and found that some pet meds I had were made in the same facilities as human meds. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1310640 United States 01/22/2013 01:22 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I asked my doctor one day about his. So I wasn't too crazy because he's had the question before. Quoting: PENG So he says, yeah, in general they can be used as it obviously is the antibiotic humans use. Only two things he mentioned: 1 was the pharmaceutical quality, where they are manufactured. The standards are not the same (think meningitis), and 2: the biggest difference are the binding agents. Fish meds are meant to be dissolved in water and the binding agent is very different than human meds as we have acid to break down the meds. So he said dosing is very difficult. Usually the problem is that by the time you would take your last dosage, because of the different binding agent, the first dosage would just be taking effect. He didn't seem concerned about the actual danger, just the effectiveness. But, if things really really really got bad, it's worth a stab I suppose. I just wouldn't be taking them to save money. Lol. In many cases there is a number on the pill that you can look up online to see where it is manufactured. I tried this and found that some pet meds I had were made in the same facilities as human meds. Theyre all made in the same places or equivalent. It would be too expensive to duplicate facilities, and the majority of antibiotics MADE and USED is for ANIMALS, not people |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 28070593 United Kingdom 01/22/2013 01:29 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | You made a comment about Cipro inducing deafness if taken for 2 or 3 days. Why don't you fully explain yourself ? It's easy to criticize but why not educate us with what you know ? Quoting: Morpheus Apparently rare side effect for Cipro in humans and hasn't been conclusively shown in animal models, however a casual glance around the internet on forums says otherwise. Dont just take my word for it, google 'tinnitus cipro' ' cipro hearing loss' etc. Seems plenty of people have been having hearing related side effects. Potential deafness due to toxicity is a known side effect of some potent injected antibiotics such as Gentamicin. I'm not saying dont ever take cipro, id rather risk being deaf than dead, but i think it would be a shame for unaware people to buy cipro on the internet and then take it when they have an infected fingernail only to suffer partial hearing loss within a week and not know why. |
CtYankee
User ID: 30129105 United States 01/22/2013 01:36 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |