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Free Will vs. Predestination (Bible Believers)
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[quote:Mr_Electric:MV8xODcyMTU4XzMxMjMyNDMxX0Y0QjcwQTU2] [quote:Anonymous Coward 14714091:MV8xODcyMTU4XzMxMjMyMjk2Xzk0QjEwQkNE] [quote:ToyTV:MV8xODcyMTU4XzUzQzFBQjQw] I am curious about believers views of free will vs predestination as a salvation issue. Were some chosen and others not prior to creation? I have always been a free will believer. But toight I got into a debate with a predestination believer. I am curious as to others insight on the matter. Do you believe saved people have always been saved from the beginning? Or is it a choice? [/quote] i will tell you some truths from my own life: i never believed in predestination but 4 yrs back an old astrologer lady told me something about my future and it became true.now i am so depressed,i cant decide whether human beings have any free will. [/quote] You need not worry my friend... for when you get to know the heart of God, you will know that HE IS GOOD THROUGH AND THROUGH and will not do anything to anyone that is evil. This is what I have learned. To be comfortable with God's sovereignty in predestination, one only has to truly trust the motives and heart of God (YHWH) Himself. This is what is on trial nowadays and why many thrash against the LORD. They do NOT trust His heart and they SUSPECT HIS MOTIVES. How very sad. It was Satan who first planted the seed of doubt into man's heart about God and the MOTIVE of God. This is seeing TOTAL FRUITION in our day. Satan told Adam and Eve in the garden that their TOTAL TRUST in God's words (heart and motive) was the REASON God had them under His TOTAL CONTROL. [b][i][u](Sound familiar???)[/u][/i][/b] He told them that the moment they disobeyed and ate the fruit that their eyes would be OPENED (sound familiar??) and they would know good and evil and BE AS GOD.... and that God wanted to HIDE THIS FROM THEM. Really what he was telling them is that the trust between them and God would be destroyed. They wouldn't believe Him anymore and that they would be able to use this "new" state of mind to... DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES WHAT WAS GOOD AND WHAT WAS EVIL. To make up their own rules. Don't believe Satan, my friend. Trust in the heart of God for it is RIGHTEOUS AND GOOD and you will find that God is leading you into His kingdom for YOUR GOOD!! We may have to traverse dark valleys through pain and suffering, but even a pearl is formed through the suffering of the clam when sand enters the shell and irritates the soft clam flesh. The clam excretes a substance to sooth it and this is what forms the PEARL. This is why Christ said that the gates of Heaven were likened to PEARLS. We enter through suffering. It produces in us something that is of ETERNAL VALUE. This is why NOT MANY choose the NARROW WAY. They do NOT want to go through any suffering! Open the eyes of your understanding back to the truth, the truth that was BEFORE the lie became the truth. ;-) God bless! [/quote]
Original Message
I am curious about believers views of free will vs predestination as a salvation issue. Were some chosen and others not prior to creation?
I have always been a free will believer. But toight I got into a debate with a predestination believer.
I am curious as to others insight on the matter.
Do you believe saved people have always been saved from the beginning? Or is it a choice?
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